Is the Church Headed for a Big Revival? | thebereancall.org

Is the Church Headed for a Big Revival?

February 9, 2003
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Tom: Thanks, Gary.You’re listening to Search the Scriptures Daily, a program in which we encourage everyone who desires to know God’s truth to look to God’s Word for all that is essential for salvation and living one’s life in a way that is pleasing to him.Now Dave last week we never got to a question, we just started talking.

Dave:

Your fault, Tom, I’m just along for the ride.

Tom:

Well, I’m going to try and make up for it and we’re going—

Dave:

Do two questions?

Tom:

No, I’m just going to cut down the chitchat and we’re going to get right to it.Our question which is from Dave’s book is as many of our listeners know, we’ve been going through Dave’s book, In Defense of the Faith, and these are questions that Dave has had posed to him through fifty-some years of ministry.So, they are good questions and they deserve good answers so I hope we, by the grace of God, can come up with some.” have been taught (and it seems to be biblical) that we Christians will return with Christ at Armageddon and destroy those who are attacking Israel.As a Christian, to kill anyone is repugnant to me.Why is this slaughter necessary?

Dave:

Tom, that’s a tough question that comes up, actually very much in The Old Testament, of course.Well, let’s go back to the Flood.There may have been millions of people on earth who survived——--.Why was that necessary?We know that the judge of all the earth will be right.There must have been no other way.The wickedness was so great, the evil and I don’t know the details of that, the Bible doesn’t give them to us, that God was in His righteousness forced to wipe out all flesh.The same with Sodom and Gomorrah and the same with the Canaanites when the children of Israel were brought in there by God into the Promised Land.And you get a hint of it in Genesis 15, where God tells Abraham he is going to give him this land, his descendants that is, but he said I can’t give it to you yet because the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.So in other words those people are not wicked enough yet to justify my wiping them out.And this world is ripening for God’s judgment again.And you would think that during the great tribulation there would be so many signs from heaven that there could be no doubt.You have the two witnesses preaching in Jerusalem for three-and a half years.You can’t touch them—they can bring fire from heaven.There couldn’t be any doubt that God is the one who directed them to do this.And then they are allowed to be killed, God allows them to be killed, their bodies lie three and a half days in the streets of Jerusalem and then suddenly they are raised from the dead and taken to heaven.Now here again you have an incredible sign, all kinds of signs, and yet it only seems to harden the hearts of people on earth.The Antichrist is worshipped by mankind and so forth.So, it gets to the point where God has no alternative.And it’s like a parent.

Tom:

But a parent has no heart to do that.You know, we’ve read before, Ezekiel:33:11: “Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live:turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?”Now these are his own, his chosen people that he is speaking to, but that’s his heart for all.

Dave:

It’s one of the most amazing things in the Bible as you read it, no one saw miracles like the children of Israel and the Red Sea opening before them and then drowning the Egyptians who tried to follow them—manna every day, led by a pillar of fire by night, a pillar of cloud by day that told them step by step where to go—water coming out of a rock gushing out.I mean the miracles that they had and their clothes never wore out, their shoes never wore out—God speaking with an audible voice from Mount Sinai.You would think, wow! That’s convincing enough!There wouldn’t be any doubts and yet they were the most rebellious people the world has ever seen.And we have people today who think, If we could just do signs and wonders, you know, like Benny Hinn claims, but probably many people saw the expose’ on him some time ago, people that thought they were healed, that he claimed were healed of cancer, died within days or weeks after their supposed healing and so forth.But people think, if we could just have miracles, then everybody would believe.No, it’s not a matter of miracles, it’s even not a matter of evidence, although I like to argue the evidence, we should give people the evidence, but there are some people who, you know the old saying: Don’t confuse me with facts, my mind is made up!And no matter how much evidence you give them, they refuse to believe because they are stubborn.I think of that in relationship to evolution for example.You remember Sir Fred Hoyle, astronomer, mathematician, this is years ago before we had DNA, which is just now beyond the mathematical probabilities, but he gave you the mathematical probability that, what are the odds that supposedly the entire universe if made of the stuff of life stirred around for billions of years and what are the odds, just the mathematical odds, you’ve got to line up so many molecules in the right order that you can get the basis enzymes of life.He calculated it to be 10 to the -40,000, which is one chance in one with 40,000 zeros after it.Now that’s absolutely impossible, and then Sir Fred Hoyle said they all know it’s impossible.Why do the keep teaching it?Because it’s academically respected.So, to be an evolutionist you have to be so—I’m sorry, evolutionists out there, you’ve got to be very perverse, you’ve got to be very determined to go against the evidence.You couldn’t possibly believe that honestly.It’s only because you are determined not to obey God, you don’t want to be accountable to God so you’ve got to come up with all of this nonsense about chance and billions of years.It won’t work!It’s impossible!So I guess it comes to that point with Armageddon.

Tom:

Well, before that Dave, just to give another example; talk about how perverse our hearts are.Here Israel rebels and then God sends serpents killing them; these are poisonous serpents, and he gives them a solution, putting a bronze serpent on a pole.And all they are to do in faith to look upon it and they are healed.And that happens, yet do they continue, oh God is doing these things for us, I’m going to repent, I’m going to turn, and I’m going to walk in obedience to him—for a time it happened.

Dave:

Tom, if I could interject—we don’t bring this up very often but that reminds me of Calvinism.The Calvinist said John:3:16 does not mean that God loves the whole world and Christ didn’t die for everyone.But you just gave an example, the serpents in the wilderness that bit people, and the brass serpent was put upon a pole and God said to Moses whoever looks to it will live.It doesn’t tell us that it was for some elect among the Israelites.And we get the impression that all the Israelites, except maybe a very few doubters, looked to that pole and lived.Okay, looked at that serpent on the pole and lived.What did Jesus say?John:3:14 and 15, “And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.”Now they have a direct parallel and you have the Old Testament sacrifices, the Passover for example, that wasn’t for an elect among Israel, that was everybody who believed and who put the blood on the doorpost and the lintel of the house would be saved.The day of atonement- everyone and the Bible tells us that these were examples and these were pictures of the sacrifice of Christ.Anyway, you brought it up, the serpent in the wilderness, Tom, I didn’t.

Tom:

We’ve got a question in another segment that relates, not relates specifically to that but it relates to serpents and it will help us to refer back.

Dave:

We didn’t finish the question, Tom.He wants to know about how are we going to feel going down there and killing people.Well, we’re not going to be killing anybody.Christ with a word will destroy his armies.

Tom:

Well Dave, for some of our listeners let’s set up what Armageddon is.

Dave:

Well, the whole world is going to effect the final solution to the Jewish problem, like Hitler tried, and now the armies of the world, led by Antichrist, come to Israel to destroy Israel.You can see this coming.I mean why should we continue to support this little group of Jews over there when the Arabs have the oil money and we’re just making it tough on ourselves, let’s just get rid of them.Whether that’s the rationale, I don’t know, but you know anti-Semitism has been going on for many years.And so here comes all the nations of the world and they’re coming to destroy Israel.By the way, it would take all the nations of the world because the IDF (the Israelis Defense Forces) are the best in the world, so they are not going to play around.

Tom:

Just roll over.

Dave:

The whole world gathers.Israel is not going to go down without using its ultimate weapons.They can launch nuclear missiles from submarines and I think that’s what Christ meant when He said that He would have to intervene—except those days be shortened no flesh would survive.And He’s going to intervene, at exactly what point, how much destruction will have happened already, I don’t know, but He’s going to intervene and rescue Israel and destroy the armies who have come against her.

Tom:

So, this is the Second Coming; He is returning with his saints and at least from the misunderstanding of whoever posed this question, looks like the saints are going to be involved in the battle.That’s why, I guess, they asked: to kill anyone is repugnant to me, why is this slaughter necessary?

Dave:

We explained why it was necessary but the saints don’t get involved.And we could just read from 2 Thessalonians:1:7-10, Paul says, “And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.”That’s a frightening picture but that’s exactly what the Bible says and this is reluctant justice on God’s part, who has pleaded with man, who has been patient, withheld His judgment, finally He has to do it.

Tom:

As we read in Ezekiel, they wouldn’t turn and live.It seems like they had an option here, Dave, and they do.All right, our next question:“I hear so much in these days about the last decade of this century (leading up to the year 2000) being a time of unprecedented revival?What do you think?Now Dave, you’re probably wondering why I put this in.This is a done deal 2003.

Dave:

It’s in the book.

Tom:

I know.Let’s check you out on this, I figure here’s an opportunity.So, is this biblical?In other words, you were asked the question are we going to have a great revival and everybody was really pushing for it and promoting it.

Dave:

Wow! Were they ever.Joining with the Catholics—the Catholics had Evangelism 2000 program going, Bill Bright and Charles Colson and various ones who were joining with them.They were going to evangelize the world by the year 2000.Well, we’re past the year 2000 and it didn’t happen and the response that I gave in the book was, there is nothing in the Bible about the last decade of this century.Where did they get this idea?Why is it that?—well someone has called it millennial madness—and we had Y2K and so much was focused on the year 2000.

Tom:

Dave, let me just give you a quick quote.This is from the chairman of the 1988 Washington for Jesus March.Quote, he’s putting Satan on notice that his day is over.However, it didn’t happen, it didn’t happen in the year 2000, hasn’t happened yet.

Dave:

Well Tom, it’s sad that sometimes these ideas—it’s sensational, its fanaticism, and you can’t fault their enthusiasm and zeal.

Tom:

No, but we all want revival, who doesn’t, but we can’t impose something.You can have revival in your heart, I’m not saying there won’t be pockets of revival here, but world wide revival?

Dave:

Well, Jesus gives us the opposite impression.Luke:18:8 he says, When the Son of man cometh, shall he find the faith on the earth?It doesn’t sound like great revival, it sounds like you’re going to have to look pretty hard to find those who are true to Him.On the other hand, He says many will say to him on that day, Lord, Lord, didn’t we prophesy in your name, we cast out demons, we did miracles.He says I will say I never knew you.So, he also indicates there would be a great signs and wonders movement in the last days.Many people posing as religious leaders as healers and prophets and so forth who are actually not His own.They don’t belong to Him because He says, I never knew you.Yet the faith is waning, evil men, Paul says, and seducers will wax worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.And in fact, Paul says specifically, 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 verse 3, don’t let anybody (I will just put it in modern lingo), don’t let anybody sweet talk you with this idea of a last days’ revival.That day, that is the day of the Lord, will not come except the apostasy come, the falling away.

Tom:

Now Dave, what you just laid out, from the Scriptures, that’s a warning about what’s going to take place. But are we hearing these warnings reflected in sermons and teachings in the church and so on.I think we’re seeing just the opposite that preachers are smoothing things over and talking about coming together and the whole ecumenical thrust.It seems to be the antithesis of what the Bible said we ought to be doing in the last days.

Dave:

Well, Robert Schuller has us getting together with the Muslims. And the Muslims have the wrong Jesus; they say He didn’t die on the cross and so forth.Tom, one of the things that concerns me is, instead of looking for the rapture,— oh that idea is being criticized—oh you guys just want an escape, a helicopter escape from this earth—why don’t you face up to the problems in this world and try to straighten them out, that’s what we are supposed to do.Well, I believe we should do all we can to solve the problems on this earth, but the main thing we must do is to preach the gospel, to tell people you don’t stay on this earth forever and one day we die and we had better be prepared for eternity.So instead of talking about the hope that Paul says, looking for, the blessed hope, the glorious appearing of the great God our savior Jesus Christ, instead of looking forward to that and as John said, everyone who has this hope in him purifies himself.We’re going to be like Jesus; we’re going to see Him.They’re talking about staying on this earth; we’re going to make it better, it’s going to get better and better; we’re going to clean up the earth and turn it into the paradise and they were going to do that by the year 2000 that was the big marker.But it simply was not biblical.

Tom:

Now Dave, when you say, “they”, certainly the thrust of many groups toward the end of that last century, the 1900’s, the 20th century, but Dave, earlier you mentioned, although there are different pockets, different groups of people, even within biblical Christianity or those who would claim to be professing Christians, we find pockets of these whether it be the Kingdom Now, the Word Faith group, but we also find it—you talked about Calvinism but reformed theology, amillennialism, isn’t amillennialism the heart of Reformed Theology and doesn’t that say that Satan is bound, the earth is going to blossom?

Dave:

Well, they would say that we are in the millennium right now.In fact, some of them like Gary DeMar—

Tom:

They don’t mean a thousand year millennium.

Dave:

No, they don’t believe in a thousand millennium, they say that we are in the millennium now, not a thousand years, Christ is reigning.In fact, people like Gary DeMar, Reconstructionists, say, we are in the new heavens and the new earth.We must be in the slums, Tom, I don’t know how you could correlate this with what the Bible says about the new heavens and the new earth.But anyway, there is a rejection of the apostasy that Christ said would come.He warned, Many will come in my name saying, I am the Christ; there will false prophets arise and so forth.He didn’t tell us it was going to get better and better.In fact, Matthew 25, he says, as the bridegroom tarried, that is, the bridegroom would go off the build a home for his bride…

Tom:

Catch Him to His Father’s house…

Dave:

Like Jesus said, I am going to my Father’s house and prepare a place for you.And then he would try to catch his bride unawares, catch her by surprise.And you get that picture when Christ talks about the Rapture, coming for his bride—at such an hour as you think not—watch, be ready, because I’m going to catch you by surprise.And then he tells us in Matthew 25, “while the bridegroom tarried…They all slumbered and slept—this is the ten virgins, of course, five wise, five foolish, but it wasn’t just the five foolish who slumbered and slept, it was all ten of them.You get the impression that Christ—you don’t want to think this, Tom, because the idea is, well, He’s not going to come back for a church that isn’t expecting Him, he’s not going to come back for a church that isn’t living for Him, and so forth.But you do get the impression from what Christ saidthat he’s coming back for a sleeping church, not expecting Him.And then it says at midnight there arose a great cry, Behold, the bridegroom cometh, go ye out to meet Him.I’ve been trying to sound that cry for some time.The rapture is at hand, be ready!Let’s watch and wait and let’s serve Him and do all we can to hasten the day of the Lord by bringing in the lost into the fold.

Tom:

Dave, I remember talking to, this was at CBA Christian Booksellers Assn., talking to a preterist, one who believes that all of the prophecies of the Bible have already been complete.This was an interesting conversation.

Dave:

This was the annual convention?There are all kinds of books on sale that—

Tom:

He had a large booth and big banners and so on and I asked him, I said, well, wait a minute, I don’t quite get this.If Jesus has returned and we’re in the Millennium and things are getting better, what’s the problem?I mean, I look around and I don’t see any improvement, I think (to quote the Scriptures) things are waxing worse and waxing worse.Do you know what he said to me?Well, I said, what’s the problem?He said, dispensationalism.In other words those of us who are occupying yet looking for the imminent return of Christ, supposedly we are in a hammock somewhere and not doing anything and we are the ones who, you know, are sleeping, in a sense.We weren’t doing the things necessary to produce the fruit that will be produced in the Millennium.

Dave:

Yeah, it’s our fault because we’re not helping them make the world better and better, but the world isn’t going to get better and better.Well Tom, the Bible tells us that this is the great hope, the Rapture, (not to make the world) better and there is no greater motivation, I believe, for godly living and preaching the gospel than recognizing the Rapture could occur at any time.So we don’t have much time.We had better do what we can now.Furthermore, shouldn’t the bride be longing to meet the bridegroom?If she’s not, you had better call the wedding off, there is something wrong.

Program Number: 
0703a

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